You had me at “Dark Energy”


When you’re busy fighting against the forces of superstition, dogma and pseudoscience, you can often forget about the smaller doses of idiocy that go almost completely ignored. Take Flat-Earthers. I mean, no one even bothers to debunk these clowns anymore. It’s gotten so bad that they end up doing most of the hard work of calling them on their retarded shit for you.

Take the FAQ for the Flat Earth Society. It attempts to lay out all the arguments against their wacky belief, and by doing so, instantly arms anyone with the ability to debunk this garbage. Take a look at these hilarious claims:

  • Satellites are a lie. Sustained spaceflight is impossible, and all signals are broadcast from towers or ground based satellites.
  • The Sun and moon are 32 miles in diameter and are suspended above the earth via Dark Energy [NOTE: oh look, they learned a scientific term!].
  • The Earth is constantly accelerating, thereby providing the experience of gravity. [NOTE: presumably without end].
  • A vast “Icewall” protects the worlds oceans from falling off the sides.
  • The atmosphere is actually an Atmolayer [NOTE: whatever the fuck that means].
  • The sun and the moon have gravity, but the Earth does not, because it’s special.
  • The North pole is cold because the 32 mile wide sun circles around the equator.
  • Time zones exists because the sun doesn’t emit light in all directions, but rather is like a spotlight.
  • Eclipses are caused by the “antimoon”, a mysterious moon shaped black body.
  • If you drive directly southward, you will eventually fall off the edge [NOTE: none of their "scientists" have yet attempted this daring scientific experiment].
  • The Coriolis Effect is a lie.
  • All space-based organizations are involved in a global conspiracy to keep the truth of the earth’s flatness hidden.
  • The giant “Icewall” is guarded by a government agents to prevent people from exploring it. No one has survived the attempt.

Where does one even begin? The antimoon? Government conspiracies to prevent people from realizing they’re are living on a constantly accelerating disk orbited (somehow) by a 32 mile wide spotlight and its glowing cousin? Yes, it all makes sense now! America is going bankrupt trying to pay off everyone to keep the Icewall a secret. Can you imagine what’ll happen if it melts away?

Comments (84)

  • avatar

    Kyle

    Time to add Atmoslayer to the list of band names that I will sadly never use.

  • avatar

    Eliot

    The word is atmolayer, not atmoslayer. You’re right, atmoslayer wouldn’t make a lot of sense; the reasoning behind calling it the atmolayer as opposed to atmosphere when talking about a flat Earth is quite obvious. I guess if we’re to take anything useful from this, it’s that one’s acceptance of atheism is no indication of one’s overall intelligence, as is often assumed by arrogant atheists.

  • avatar

    Jacob Fortin

    Yeah, spelling mistakes are often the sign of stupidity…or a sign might be believing that a giant icewall prevents the ocean from falling off the sides.

    Hey, here’s an idea Eliot. Take a hot air balloon, tie a camera to it with a GPS device, and let it float up. In just a few hours, you’ll have film proof that the Earth is round. Better yet, just watch the video of someone who did just that.

    I bet you think they faked that one, eh genius?

  • avatar

    Eliot

    Two things, Jacob: 1) I don’t believe in a flat Earth. Not sure why you assume I do.

    2) This was not a spelling error. This was an issue of reading comprehension, and to a fair degree lack of common sense. I’d like to refer you both to rif.org. It’s generally wise when mocking the stupidity of others to at least try to come off as intelligent as possible; unfortunately the good atheist failed in this endeavor.

  • avatar

    Jacob Fortin

    Your smug comment lead me to believe that you might be some hack from the site I was commenting on. My apologies for that mistake.

    As for the rest of your comments, I’d say the only endeavor I’ve accomplished is feeding a troll past midnight.

  • avatar

    Eliot

    I am from that site you commented on. And I’m quite serious about everything I’ve said. Seriously, think about it in the future; you don’t want to look like a fucking retard when calling other people fucking retarded. Also, lol at calling me smug. Kind of a pot meets kettle situation there.

  • avatar

    Michael

    If earth was constantly accelerating, so as to provide the illusion of gravity, wouldn’t only one side of the earth have this “gravity?” As an analogy, let’s imagine a situation involving two people and a van(presumably down by the river): If one person was standing on the front bumper of a van and the second was standing on the back bumper, upon acceleration , the person on the front of the van would experience a pseudo-force and stay platned to the windshield whereas the person on the back would fall off.

  • avatar

    Michael

    @Eliot
    I’d imagine that the reason he assumed you were one is that you seem to take insults of the position very personally. If you don’t actually believe in this stuff, I guess the tone of your voice can be accounted for by the fact that you know what it’s like to be crticized for holding stupid beliefs.

  • avatar

    Verrine

    @MICHAEL
    The Earth is accelerating upwards.

  • avatar

    Apollo

    No wonder our governments never get anything done, they’re involved in so many cover-ups and conspiracies they don’t have time to do thier day-today work…[/sarcasm]

  • avatar

    PizzaPlanet

    I am posting in this quality thread.

    Jacob, a suggestion for you: Spend more than 15 minutes on a forum before blogging about it. It will help you know where to “begin” next time. As for you calling the other guy smug: please be sure to have a look at your favicon/avatar/site’s logo. Afterwards, have a look at your favourite dictionary’s definition of “smug”. Then, look at the logo/avatar/icon again. Do you begin to see a pattern?

    Also, yes, I’m an FE’er. No, I don’t feel any more insulted than by any other angry noob that visits the forum (and, as you would imagine, we get lots of those). “Lurk more” (in this particular case worded slightly more intricately) is a fairly generic and common answer on our side of the plane.

  • avatar

    Michael Beares

    @Michael, actually I believe it would be more that our “gravity” would actually increase over time. That is if the earth is constantly accelerating, they state it accelerates at a rate of 9.81m/s2.

    Also they believe that only the upper half of the disc is inhabited, the other side is more or less a rocky region.

    from their site:
    “Q: “What is underneath the Earth?”

    A: This is unknown. Most FE proponents believe that it is generally composed of rocks. Please note that in Hinduism, the Earth rests on the back of four elephants and a turtle.”

    @Eliot you did come off pretty smug in your posts. Jake did as well, but if you knew anything about the site you would know that is how he is, and we like him for it. So simmer down just because you were called out for shit you said on his site.

  • avatar

    Ichi

    Jacob,
    spend a night under the light of a full moon and we’ll see who’s laughing.

  • avatar

    Particle Person

    You could have tried something different and approached the situation with a sense of humour.

  • avatar

    Blanko

    [NOTE: This looks fucking stupid.]

  • avatar

    Kyle

    Wow…. People are actually defending this bullshit?

    Know what? Fuck it. I’m simply going to refuse to believe that anyone with access to a computer believes that the Earth is flat. Evolution deniers a idiotic enough, but anyone, any single person on this planet without requiring much at all in the way of resources, can circumnavigate the globe. That there might possibly be someone who can dick around on the internet and serriously claim that the planet is flat, without taking the minimal amount of effort necessary to “prove” that such is the case is unfathomable. There’s no possible way that this is not a joke site perpetuated by people who are very dedicated to the gag.

  • avatar

    Blanko

    [NOTE: All self-proclaiming atheists are pretentious dickwads who really shouldn't go around judging others.]

  • avatar

    Ichi

    Kyle,
    you do realize circumnavigation is possible on a flat earth right? LOL I knew atheists were ‘special’ but you guys deserve a frickin medal.

  • avatar

    agentsmith

    ^ Soooo… you’re seriously saying the earth really is flat? Seriously?

  • avatar

    NotSillyRob

    Yay the flat Earthers are coming out of hiding from their website to spread peace, love and untested hypotheses all over the internet!

  • avatar

    Harkanin

    I love how we are being bashed based on “religious” (for lack of a better term) beliefs, as opposed to their stupid conspiracy filled bullshit of the planet fucking Earth being flat. Also they believe we are supper goddamned special because that site said only Earth is flat. Come the fuck on how retarded is that bullshit. Next you will say I’m an idiot cause I like to swear, well fuck off.

  • avatar

    Apollo

    As funny as this is, they are effectively harmless. Their flat earth does not demand tribute or sacrifice or subjugation of others.. so I’ll be giving it no more of my time.

    An interesting interlude, but let’s get back to more important things.

    :)

  • avatar

    Harkanin

    Good point Apollo seeing as how they have become trolls, and its just annoying as hell. At least it was a change from religious rhetoric.

  • avatar

    John

    Well, people are stupid enough to kill other people so why wouldn’t they be stupid enough to believe in this crazy shit?

    It’s got to be the weakest conspiracy theory ever.

    I’d be surprised if these idiots didn’t trip over their own eyeballs regularly, if it even is a genuine conspiracy theory (a paradox if ever there was one).

    Personally I think it’s a joke, literally, one of these things where they want people to think they’re serious when they really aren’t and are laughing at the people who believe that they believe that the world is flat. Who’s the gullible party in this scenario?

    Same way Ratzinger laughs himself to sleep every night at the gullibilitiy of humankind.

  • avatar

    McTaffity

    Wow those FE’ers really like to put the boot in…

  • avatar

    Jacob Fortin

    6Pizza, I am smug. I never denied it. Usually when you don’t believe in crazy fucking nonsense, you tend to. Hey, here’s a nutty idea: why don’t you test your retarded hypothesis. Seems like the easiest thing to prove if you’re right. I already suggested a way to test your hypothesis. Does it scare you to think that you and your compatriots know almost nothing about science except perhaps a few choice terms? Do you clowns even have any idea what Dark Energy is, or how your idea of constant acceleration is both insane and impossible? Honestly, you’re a fucking embarrassment to humanity with this stupidity.

    Check out this article on “black holes” in thinking. You sir, are trapped.

    http://richarddawkins.net/articles/641072-a-field-guide-to-bullshit

  • avatar

    spector567

    Wow. Can we get more track backs. It’s actually kinda fun.

    What I find most amusing is how the Flat Earthers are calling Athiests Arrogent. It’s an accurate reponse to saying rediculas things.

    What I find arrogent is that they believe that about a billion people are all trying to keep a massive secret just from them.

    I find It arrogent that they can declare half of human history and almost all physics a lie just for them.

    the one thing I’d love one of them to tell me is WHY

    For what reason would over 200 goverments and cultures from around the world as well as several million people have for pepetuating this myth for over 500 years. What is so important.

    And are Flat Earthers concerned about global warming??? Afterall if the glacial walls melt wouldn’t it mean the end of all human kind as the worlds water flows out into space?

  • avatar

    John Davis

    Its easy to discount these ideas at cursory glance as nonsense and anti-intellectual. In reality though, this is no worse than subscribing to a God. You are taking something at face value prior to doing any amount of real in depth study on it.

    Sure, there are those that are flat earthers due to religious or non-logical reasons. However, the modern society is largely secular. We have a lot to say thats not dribble.

    However, as I understand any human can be so stout in their beliefs not to examine counter-evidence to their own worldview, if you take nothing else from the whole “Flat Earth” debacle, take its underlying message about the epistemological value of science.

    The scientific community is no longer searching truth, and where they do search truth, it is under some assumptions that should not be made.

    No serious scientist (differentiate from a specialist) would say any of the theories or laws they work on are right. This is the fundamental pin that holds science together. Without it, we might as well all call it a day and go home because we can be content that we know everything.

    Clearly theories are made to be superceded. Why not attack the problem from a non-biased angle and instead examine data, not the hypothesis?

    A good example of this in work is the founding of the field of Chronobiology.

  • avatar

    Ichi

    The Earth looks flat. Burden of proof is on you globularists to prove otherwise.

    As for Jacob: l-o-l! You think you know science by watching Dawkins on youtube?

  • avatar

    John Davis

    Burden of proof arguments are a waste of time to all involved. We aren’t trying to find some sort of truth through strict adherence to arbitrary argumentative laws. In the end anyone can point at the other party and say “the burden is on you.” The burden is on everyone.

  • avatar

    Jacob Fortin

    John, firstly, the Data is just not on your side. The Sun is a spotlight? While no scientist will ever say that their theories are complete, they are models to understand the Universe. Ptolemy would laugh his ass off at your model. It makes no predictions. Instead, it’s based on a predetermined conclusion, and then you stretch the truth to try and make it fit. That’s not good science.

    “Its easy to discount these ideas at cursory glance as nonsense and anti-intellectual. In reality though, this is no worse than subscribing to a God. You are taking something at face value prior to doing any amount of real in depth study on it.”

    Religious people accuse atheists all the time of not doing enough research, as though nonsense needs to be understood to be rejected. It’s funny that you mentioned that your beliefs are no worse than the belief in God. I agree. Both are based on the denial of physical reality and evidence, and both are accepted without evidence. (oh, and lets not forget your insane conspiracy theories to make everything work out)

    Seriously, do you have any fucking clue how easy it is to test your retarded hypothesis? The Brooklyn Space Program did it with a weather balloon, a GPS and a camera. Do you have a better scientific experiment to test your fucking hypothesis? Cuz that’s what doing science is all about, dude.

  • avatar

    Ichi

    Maybe Jacob if you researched for 5 mins, you would realize why those balloon releases don’t provide any evidence for Earth’s shape. Whatever it may be.

  • avatar

    Jacob Fortin

    Also, I think ICHI wins the award for most idiotic statement of the month. The burden of proof is on us “globularists” [must be his own word for "people who don't believe in dumb shit"]! Also, any proof is merely part of the conspiracy to keep the flatness of the earth secret forever! So good luck convincing someone that profoundly ignorant that he’s insane.

    Hey, you you think if we sent him up in a space shuttle, he’s still deny that it was a sphere?

  • avatar

    Bill M.

    And all of it rests on the backs of four elephants which, in turn, stand on the back of a giant turtle.

  • avatar

    Blanko

    [NOTE: Atheism is a belief, so don't you just come across as quite a hypocrite, kid?]

  • avatar

    John Davis

    Hey Jacob, thanks for your response.

    Data is not on any side, it just is. It makes no theories. A true zeteticist (which you may have a hard time finding on theflatearthsociety site) doesn’t either.

    I never claimed the sun is a spotlight; that is indeed a ridiculous claim. Anything needs to be at least reviewed before rejected. That is good science, no matter what shape you think the earth is. Pretty rudimentary stuff. Its simple to refute religious claims on the basis of a lack of supporting empirical evidence.

    My beliefs are less ridiculous than believing in God. However, if you’d care to reread my post you’ll see I again made no claim concerning my beliefs. I said rejecting things out of hand is on the same level as believing in a God.

    It should also be noted I don’t believe in any sort of crazy conspiracy. That’s just silly imho. I’d rather believe that people are ignorant not evil as we’ve seen time and time again (and as mentioned is the basis of continuing scientific endeavor…)

    I think you must have missed the point of my post, and clearly you have missed my concerns with “what science is all about.”

    I’m well aware with how one can test the shape of the earth. However, there is more at stake here than that. Its clear I’ll never change your mind concerning the earth’s shape and I have no aim to. There are models within flat earth theory (many you may not be able to find simply by googling or reading a faq) that account for the experiments in question.

    Consider this: for any simple mathematical model there is by necessity a more complex mathematical model that describes the same input/output. This is painfully obvious and does not need to be shown, I hope.

    Now at this point during writing this I can already hear the yell of the astute scientist – “Ockham’s Razor!” We must remember that the razor is simply a tool and by no means something that must be given any validity at all. Its use is simply to make science, engineering and life easier – not to seek truth.

    Now, I’m not saying we should all start believing fairies push things down to the ground (unless that can be supported empirically), but what I am saying is that we should not discount work simply based on its complexity.

    More importantly, my original point was that science has some serious flaws that should be addressed. Now, this doesn’t discount everything science has provided and that has worked for us, but in today’s age to a certain degree science has taken the place of religion as well as the sacred spot it held. To try to say anything is slightly wrong about the methodology or assumptions inherent in the scientific method is similar to attacking any religious rhetoric in the hand of the insane believer. This is against the very idea behind science, and its a shame we’ve come to that point.

  • avatar

    John Davis

    Also, thank you for your hospitality on your site. I’ll check back on this in a few days.

  • avatar

    Harkanin

    I appreciate how John has been posting as opposed to Blanko or ICHI, who are both being dorks.

  • avatar

    Jacob Fortin

    John, you’re obviously not stupid, but this idea you have that “science is seriously flawed” indicates that I’m not really sure you understand what science is really all about. It’s a process, not a thing. It’s like saying that using experiment, observation, repeatable tests and all is no better than simply inventing an idea and then trying to prove that it works. Science does make such claims, but in the end, the process demands evidence, and if it doesn’t fit, then the model is rejected.

    Seriously, there are some simple ways to actually find out that the earth is round. The diameter of the Earth was actually figured out during the time of the Greek. A man by the name of Eratosthenes who was able to roughly calculate it. All he needed to do was measure the shadow of an arbitrary measuring device in two different locations on the same time and day of the year. From the difference in shadow length he was able to calculate, within a few thousand kilometers, the circumference of the Earth.

    This same experiment can be conducted today with the same result. It’s a simple example of an experiment, easily duplicated, which demonstrates the correctness of the idea that the Earth is a sphere.

    Here’s the think, John. You may not realize it – since you have so much emotionally vested in this silly business- but you actually believe in something so profoundly stupid that you’re in total denial of just how foolish this idea is. Guys like Johannes Kepler, scientists deeply committed to their false beliefs about the Universe had to acquiesce once the evidence proved that their beautiful models were simply fantasy. You have not made this conclusion yourself. you hold on to this belief when even our ancestors some 2000 years ago were able to use sticks and shadows to understand something most take for granted.

    I urge you to shake off this insanity. Don’t waste your time believing that the Universe somehow caters to human fantasies.

  • avatar

    HB

    Let’s also not forget the very simple “ship on the horizon method”; A ship traveling out beyond the view of the horizon on the open ocean will appear to slowly sink away (due to the curvature of the Earth). Of course, let us never mind the empirical data from many other reputable sources. If we close our eyes and block our ears we then might be able to imagine whatever reality we wish to observe. In any case, I’m not convinced that the FES has any member really believing in anything that is represented there. But, if I am wrong, so be it. I empathize with those who hold delusions, however. Truth and knowledge can be a very slippery thing.

  • avatar

    Michael

    How does the idea of it accelerating upward go against what i said? Same principle applies: If gravity is a phenomenon caused by acceleration, then things on the opposite of the direction of acceleration should be resisting motion and therefor not “gravitate” toward the planet. They would appear to be moving away from earth, though it would actually be the earth moving away from them.

    Another thing, how exactly do you circumnavigate a disk? Sure, you can go around the circumfrance of it, however, that is not what’s meant by circumnavigation. On a spherical, or nearly spherical object, one can travel in a straight line and return to the same place that was your origin. You can’t do that on a disk.

    And for those who doubt burden of proof, imagine this: Someone accuses you of being a murderer. Should you have to spend time defending yourself and explaining why you’re not a murderer if the prosecution doesn’t have any evidence that you are? The configuration that we have for burden of proof is the most logical one. Without it, there would be an infinite amount, not to mention irreconsilable, things to have to believe in.

  • avatar

    Eliot

    Jacob, I think the inherent flaw in science isn’t necessarily the scientific method itself, it’s the level of faith (on par with religion, as John Davis pointed out) people put in the conclusions drawn by science. There are a lot of reasons to be skeptical about a great many things we take for granted. If nothing else, FET should open people’s eyes to that very fact, whatever shape they believe the Earth to be. I guess the reason why I was drawn to the Society in the first place was the fact that people come all the time to say how ludicrous they think the idea of a flat Earth is, but more often or not, they can’t give a reasonable explanation for why the Earth must be round. It’s quite amusing. And it’s only compounded by the unexpected level of intelligence exhibited by the typical FEer, who most often is able to debate rings around the typical REer (yes, those are our terms).

    Arguing for a flat Earth can be a great way to exercise your rhetorical prowess. We actually have more regulars who are REers than are FEers, and that just wouldn’t be the case if the debates weren’t as stimulating as they are. Also, I’m fairly certain that the majority of us are of above-average intelligence, and some of us are even bona fide geniuses. Both on the FE and the RE sides.

    That’s why PizzaPlanet criticized you for criticizing our site after viewing it for what appears for all the world to actually have been no more than fifteen minutes. You had a predetermined idea of what the site would be, you skimmed the surface of our Society to decide that you were right, and you posted a long description of how stupid FET is for no other reason than to feed your need to be intellectually superior, and to make sure the world knows you’re intellectually superior. This is a trait I often see in self-described atheists, which is why I think that most of you are, in fact, quite arrogant.

    In fact your reaction to our website encapsulates that mentality. You’re not even willing to entertain the notion that there might be valid reasons to believe that a God exists (whatever form you believe He might actually take, if you even think such a thing is possible to rationally determine). You clutch hard, measurable science as the only thing that matters in the pursuit of truth, without giving thought that there might be other valid ways of measuring the truth.

    Henry David Thoreau:
    “Men are probably nearer the central truth in their superstitions than in their science.”

    I believe you are a very closed-minded individual, Jacob. And even worse I think you recognize that, and believe it makes you superior to those with more open minds.

    Consider this: the Earth looks flat. That alone is reason enough to at least be critical of the notion that we should just take for granted that it isn’t. Otherwise it’s blind faith, which I understand atheists aren’t generally fans of.

  • avatar

    Sterling Knight

    I’m not going to say anything that will spark more dabate since arguing through text isn’t even on my to-do list, but why is this continuing. Seriously, to the FES supporters here, grow the fuck up and comment on websites that are actually apllicable to your belief systems. Thank you and have a nice day.(Until the Earth rotates to a point where you can’t see the Sun anymore from your location on the planet.)

  • avatar

    Eliot

    How is a website about atheism not “applicable to our belief systems?”

  • avatar

    Eliot

    Apparently a website about belief in a flat Earth was applicable enough to Jacob’s belief system that he felt compelled to comment on it.

  • avatar

    Harkanin

    It is applicable because your belief originated from religion before science, forcing the science to prove the religious belief, granted you all may not believe in “God X”. But even the site Jake linked to originally pointed to shows some religious conotations.

  • avatar

    Sterling Knight

    There’s also a difference between reading an article on a website and continuously posting comments about a subject where the majority of other people responding disagree with you.

  • avatar

    Eliot

    @Harkanin: My belief did not originate from religion. It’s irrelevant anyway.

    @Sterling Knight: I am trying to show you why you are wrong. Jeez, I thought a bunch of atheists might enjoy a little enlightenment.

  • avatar

    Sterling Knight

    I understand you’re devotion, but it’s not enlightening if people think its bullshit and people don’t like to hear bullshit. Sorry, but when you continue to comment in a place where others resent those comments you’re doing something that is commonly refered to as trolling. Atheists in general are a mix between closed and open mindedness. If we’re shown extrodinarily convincing evidence of anything supernatural we’ll probably reconsider because that’s how we think, but we all secretly know that that’s not gonna happen. (This is my final comment on this post. I might read a few more comments, but for the most part I don’t want to get in an argument.)

  • avatar

    Harkanin

    I didn’t say your reasoning was religious just stating that the flat earth belief derived from it.

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